Curse

Aniewiel · Jul 22, 2005, 12:54 PM // 12:54

I am not a PvPer so I am sure that this might get shot down but I've been giving rushers (the level 2 Droknar's folks, I mean) some thought. Ostensibly the need to 'rush' is to unlock skills and get the best armor in the game so that they can "own" in the lower level arenas. It makes it VERY unfair for others who, because they will NOT rush the game, play with standard equipment.

My idea is this:

On entering an arena, characters are given a basic set of armor and equipment. Skills wouldn't change so rushers would still have that advantage but at least everyone would be on equal footing armor/weapon-wise.

On leaving the arena, the character is "redressed" in their godly armor.

Is something like this doable? It just seems to make it fairer to the poor guy/gal who's just trying to earn reputation and faction the...slow way-it's-supposed-to-be-done way.

Kabale · Jul 22, 2005, 01:02 PM // 13:02

Hmm don't think this is really a good idea, because there are only a few who actually do this. The majority of PvPers in low-lvl arenas use the armor they just bought at Ascalon or whatever and not being able to put it to use and having to use a default armor would kinda suck especially if you are geared towards the PvP side of the game.

I think, like many others, there should be level requirements on armor. This would solve most of the running 'problems' (it doesn't bother me that much).

Mithie · Jul 22, 2005, 01:08 PM // 13:08

Simple solution: instead of having the arena's be level based, impose a further restriction of being area based. If you've been to Lion's Arch, you can no longer go to the ascalon arena. If you've been to Drok's, you can no longer go to the LA *or* ascalon arena. So if I'm level 8 and I rush to Droks, I can't go into ANY arena's, because my level is too low for shiverpeak arena and I've already unlocked Drok, therefore unable to participate in either of the "previous" arenas until I level up a bit. Simple, elegant, easy to implement.

EDIT: (it's probably obvious, but I've made a mistake in there. I *really* mean locked out of Yak's Bend arena when you go to Lion's Arch.)

Drakron · Jul 22, 2005, 01:30 PM // 13:30

So if I have the best armor in the game I cannot go to THE LV20 ARENA?

Aniewiel · Jul 22, 2005, 01:33 PM // 13:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithie

Simple solution: instead of having the arena's be level based, impose a further restriction of being area based. If you've been to Lion's Arch, you can no longer go to the ascalon arena. If you've been to Drok's, you can no longer go to the LA *or* ascalon arena. So if I'm level 8 and I rush to Droks, I can't go into ANY arena's, because my level is too low for shiverpeak arena and I've already unlocked Drok, therefore unable to participate in either of the "previous" arenas until I level up a bit. Simple, elegant, easy to implement.

I like it. Area/Level lock the arenas. Good one.

Mithie · Jul 22, 2005, 01:39 PM // 13:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drakron

So if I have the best armor in the game I cannot go to THE LV20 ARENA?

Yeah, you can, if you're level 20...

ComMan · Jul 22, 2005, 03:00 PM // 15:00

Nono, you guys made a goof in the suggestion. If you lock people out of Lion's Arch, that means that level 20s can't go to the level 20 arena. You mean locked out of Yak's Bend when you go to Lion's Arch.

There are PvP characters in Lion's Arch arena, and they have Forge armor. We don't all want to spam LFG for Team Arena.

I like the idea of locking runners out of the lowbie arenas.

Calimar · Jul 22, 2005, 03:10 PM // 15:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithie

Simple solution: instead of having the arena's be level based, impose a further restriction of being area based. If you've been to Lion's Arch, you can no longer go to the ascalon arena. If you've been to Drok's, you can no longer go to the LA *or* ascalon arena. So if I'm level 8 and I rush to Droks, I can't go into ANY arena's, because my level is too low for shiverpeak arena and I've already unlocked Drok, therefore unable to participate in either of the "previous" arenas until I level up a bit. Simple, elegant, easy to implement.

Sounds great to me. I wouldn't put lower level requirements though... if one really WANTS to get thrashed, let him.
JMNERHO.

Mithie · Jul 22, 2005, 03:18 PM // 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by ComMan

Nono, you guys made a goof in the suggestion. If you lock people out of Lion's Arch, that means that level 20s can't go to the level 20 arena. You mean locked out of Yak's Bend when you go to Lion's Arch.

Whoopsies

Phades · Jul 22, 2005, 07:12 PM // 19:12

The alternative is to only allow the armor to be worn with a certain mission unlocked. Much in the same way ascended characters can go into underworld and fissure of woe, a player may not wear droknar's armor until they have completed the dragon's lair, a player may not wear yak's bend until nolani academy is completed ect. This would give meaning and purpose behind many of the missions. Weaponry would most likely require level restrictions in addition to skill requirements. These are mainly pve solutions as the pvp side could still be worked around with collector armor. In turn, to close the collector loop-hole, have the collectors not speak or interact with characters unless certain missions, quests, or level requirements are completed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithie

Simple solution: instead of having the arena's be level based, impose a further restriction of being area based. If you've been to Lion's Arch, you can no longer go to the ascalon arena. If you've been to Drok's, you can no longer go to the LA *or* ascalon arena. So if I'm level 8 and I rush to Droks, I can't go into ANY arena's, because my level is too low for shiverpeak arena and I've already unlocked Drok, therefore unable to participate in either of the "previous" arenas until I level up a bit. Simple, elegant, easy to implement.

EDIT: (it's probably obvious, but I've made a mistake in there. I *really* mean locked out of Yak's Bend arena when you go to Lion's Arch.)

Combine these two together and you have the closest thing to fair as its going to get.

Dax · Jul 22, 2005, 11:37 PM // 23:37

Just level cap armor like most games do...simple

Aniewiel · Jul 23, 2005, 12:02 AM // 00:02

Dax, that's the best idea yet and probably the simplest coding-wise. It would severely curtail the "running" business and I am already cringing at the wailing and gnashing of teeth that would ensue.

Eder · Jul 23, 2005, 12:30 AM // 00:30

Level cap armor at Lion's Arch levels for the Ascalon Arena (because most lvl 10s wouldn't get to Maguuma on their own).

Level cap armor at Denravi levels for the Northern Shiverpeaks Arena (because most lvl 15s wouldn't get to the desert on their own - and if they're that good, they can play at the Lion's Arch arenas anyway).

Un-equip all elites from people's skill bars when they enter Ascalon or Shiverpeak Arena and don't let them re-equip any elites while in there. What I mean is basically, limit the number of elites you can have in those arenas to *zero*.

Problem solved, mostly... I think?

Winterclaw · Jul 23, 2005, 02:24 AM // 02:24

Hmm, I think posted in a similar thread...

IMO AL should be based on primary class and level and not the armor you are wearing. Your armor is something you will choose for looks and bonuses, with the latter being dependant on level for AL increase. Get rid of all the material requirements and make it a money sink only.

This would be the simplest and most effective way of having armor.

Iceciro · Jul 23, 2005, 03:31 AM // 03:31

Hmmm - that might work, but what about the different types of armor? Gladiators armor, Knights armor, and Plate armor all have different abilities AND looks, and cost different ammounts.

Kishin · Jul 23, 2005, 04:57 AM // 04:57

Close Ascalon and Shiverpeak Arenas, roll the maps into the Competition Arena. Problem solved, Droknar's Armor can still be used to make the PvE experience less of a grind the second or third time through, young PvPers don't pick up bad habits from playing terrible, half arsed builds in the low level Arenas and still succeeding, and the skill distribution (ie, not having access to build staples) disappears for the most part.

Paul Templar · Jul 23, 2005, 06:30 AM // 06:30

good idea area lock/unlock
and lvl req on armour by the time my chars get to Droknar they are lvl 20 anyway

Gardavil · Jul 23, 2005, 12:44 PM // 12:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kishin

Close Ascalon and Shiverpeak Arenas, roll the maps into the Competition Arena. Problem solved, Droknar's Armor can still be used to make the PvE experience less of a grind the second or third time through, young PvPers don't pick up bad habits from playing terrible, half arsed builds in the low level Arenas and still succeeding, and the skill distribution (ie, not having access to build staples) disappears for the most part.

How does one discover that his/her build is half-arsed or that they have picked up bad habits? Players need time and experience to discover these things and that's what the low level arenas are for. It also keeps most of us noobs out from under foot of you Ascended Players....If there were no low level arenas, more new PvPers would try to figure out a way to get rushed up to compete with you guys faster.

We just need to figure out a way to stip the exploit of lvl 20 armor/skills/weapons in low level arenas.......then all of us low levels can learn PvP with the same advantages/disadvantages. Then it will really come down to "who is the most skilled player" not "who has the most skills" or level 20 armor.

Eder · Jul 23, 2005, 02:17 PM // 14:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kishin

Close Ascalon and Shiverpeak Arenas, roll the maps into the Competition Arena. Problem solved (...)

If by "problem solved" you mean "part of the game flushed down the toilet", then yes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Templar

and lvl req on armour by the time my chars get to Droknar they are lvl 20 anyway

That's unnecessary. Droknar's armor is not a problem outside the two low-level PvP arenas.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gardavil

We just need to figure out a way to stip the exploit of lvl 20 armor/skills/weapons in low level arenas...

Personally I don't think weapons are an issue. Someone who just got to post searing with their first character can, in theory, buy the best weapon in the game from another player if they have saved up enough gold - that's not an unfair advantage, he earned use of that weapon. Also, most max damage weapons with godly mods have an attribute requirement of *at least* 8 - which means that any low level build using one of these will be extremely unbalanced and therefore easy to pwn.

Skills and armor are the only things which you can only get (after a certain point) by having others advance you into the game, and as such they are, IMHO, the only things which need balancing in the two low level arenas.